Editing Talk:Experimental Film

== Disputed Fun Facts ==
*In the commentary, The Cheat has probably his most comprehensible lines ever, and at least one is even completely decipherable ("You don't like the video, huh?")
**I couldn't comprehend any of what The Cheat said.
**I agree. The first thing he says can be easily translated to "And this is The Cheat."

*In the commentary, Strong Sad's remark that it's the "Worst commentary ever" might be a refrence to the comic book guy on The Simpsons.
**How? And in what way?
***The comic book guy is a movie/series/comic-nerd stereotype, saying things like "worst episode ever", "worst cross-over ever" etc. For more information consult http://www.snpp.com/guides/cbg.file.html

Methinks the link to They Might Be A Wiki should be http://www.tmbw.net/wiki/index.php/Untitled/Lyrics
*The comment about the glass being full seems a bit unnecessary.
**Second That.

*The shot of the ATM with a football helmet chasing Strong Sad is a reference to [http://www.3drealms.com/keenhistory/ Commander Keen], Defender of the Universe!
**That's a big stretch. The only thing I can find in common is that the ATM has a mostly-yellow football helmet. Are yellow football helmets that rare? The ATM is doing nothing like Commander Keen (i.e. jumping, zapping, etc.) and I don't recall any Strong Sad-like enemies in the games.
***I'm going to agree. The "rivet holes" on the ATM's helmet don't match and the stripe colors on the helmets are different. Nevertheless, the yellow helmet did make me think of Commander Keen the first time I saw it.

==I just can't resist==

<i>The first line of the song is "The color of infinity inside an empty glass." Strong Sad's glass is full. </i>

* But Strong Sad would still think of it as "not-really-empty", wouldn't he? Okay, okay, bad joke over. --[[User:Jay|Jay]] 01:44, 7 Dec 2004 (MST)

:But what is an "[[Wikipedia:Is the glass half empty or half full|empty glass]]" anyway?[[User:Tom|<nowiki></nowiki>]]  --  [[User:Tom|Tom]] 11:28, 7 Dec 2004 (MST)

== I've been listening to too much music ==

Ok, this probably isn't very relevant, but I've noticed some paralells between this video and the tracks on TMBG's album Apollo 18. Only the people who have heard the CD will probably understand some of these. Also, I'm gonna skip the one's I haven't figured out yet.:

1 (Dig My Grave): Strong Sad as the grim reaper

2 (I Palindrome I): The palindromic formation of the ATM machines saying "experimental film" in the Artic.

3 (She's Actual Size): I dunno, maybe the giant finger coming from the water, since the song is about a really big woman.

4 (My Evil Twin): Everybody meeting their counterparts (and pogo-ing).

5 (Mammal): Another dubious one. Maybe the glass of water in the beginning (the lyrics in the beginning of Mammal are "glass of milk")

7 (Spider): Gavin the Cockroach. Ok, so he's not a spider per se, but he's another icky bug.

8 (The Guitar): The lion (since half of this song is about some lion)

9 (Dinner Bell): The muffin on the table.

10 (Narrow your Eyes): Strong Sad narrows his eyes after the ATM says "Check Balance??".

11 (Hall of Heads): John and John's heads, of course. Also, the "Our Gracious Host" guy.

15 (Turn Around): The skull guy riding the bike (<i>Turn around/ turn around/ it's a human skull on the ground</i>)

Well, that's all I can think of for now. Of course, I'm skipping over all the "Fingertips" songs, that would take up way too much space. Anyway, if anyone else has heard this CD and noticed any more paralells, please post 'em.

:Oh, you are going to love [http://www.tmbw.net/wiki/index.php/Main_Page This Might Be A Wiki], the wiki dedicated to TMBG.  Check out [http://www.tmbw.net/wiki/index.php/Experimental_Film their page for Experimental Film] and especially the [http://www.tmbw.net/wiki/index.php/Experimental_Film/Interpretations interpretations page for the song], where you can pretty much add what you added here.  I'm sure they'd love to hear from you.[[User:Tom|<nowiki></nowiki>]]  --  [[User:Tom|Tom]] 22:00, 30 Dec 2004 (MST)


==Awkward Actions...==

Alright, after watching this a few times, I have a question. At two points in the video, Strong Sad is bobbing his head, and you can see a film reel right next to him, then the rest of the page is blank. However, I can't figure out exactly why Strong Sad was doing. Was he nodding his head to the beat of the song or following the film reel as it moved up toward the top of the screen?

*Hmm, I always figured he was watching the film, which seems to make sense considering that he then jumps across the reel. The way I look at it, he watches the film, then decides to interact with it in some way, in this case jumping across. And Strong Sad himself doesn't really seem to acknowledge the music in the movie. It's a very good question though. --[[User:Ogog|Ogog]]

== Transcript ==

The commentary transcript does little to explain what is actually going on in the video as the characters speak.  Is there any reason this was left out?[[User:Tom|<nowiki></nowiki>]]  --  [[User:Tom|Tom]] 12:36, 19 Feb 2005 (MST)

== Closed STUFF ==

These were on the [[HRWiki:STUFF|STUFF]] page and declined. If you wish to contest these, leave a note here, but don't allow it to be confused with any of the original votes.

===The Worst Commentary Ever===
In the commentary, "Worst Commentary Ever" is probably a reference to [[Wikipedia:The Simpsons|The Simpsons]], where the [[Wikipedia:List of recurring characters from The Simpsons#Comic Book Guy (Jeff Albertson)|Comic Book Guy]] is always saying "Worst [something] ever".

*... which is in turn a reference to fans everywhere referring to every new episode of everything as the "worst ever". Even the same thing happens on the Emails board here, every email is the worst ever to someone. Besides, he's just complaining that the commentary isn't going to plan. "Worst ever" is a common enough phrase, it doesn't have to be a reference. '''Decline''' --[[User:phlip|phlip]] 01:21, 1 May 2005 (UTC)
* If he said it "Worst commentary ever" like Comic book guy (I'm talking about tone of voice) would say it then yes, yes it would be a reference. But he didn't, so '''decline''' [[user:Donny vs Universe|Donny vs Universe]]
*'''Decline.''' Seconding all the declines before this one and all the ones sure to follow. -- [[User:tomstiff|tomstiff]] 13:44, 2 May 2005 (UTC)
*'''ACSEPd''' he DID say it with the same rythm worst #stop# comimisairy #stop# ever [[User:Ganome|Ganome]]
*'''DECLINE'D!!!''' I doubt it...and c'mon, you people know that best/worst something ever is a running gag on H*R. [[User:TakuaKaita600|TK600]] 19:55, 6 May 2005 (UTC)
*<s>'''Accept''' I still think that it does ring true of the Simpsons, and that it qualifies</s> Ah for that youthful indulgence.  I change my vote to '''DECLINE''' after realizing how blantently not true this is-[[User:Tony Stony|Tony Stony]] 01:40, 11 May 2005 (UTC)
* '''Worst...Accept...EVER!!''' Yeah, I'm gonna hafta say that's true. --[[User:kerrek slaya|kerrek slaya]] 20:49, 15 May 2005 (UTC)
*<b>Decline</b> It's not said right for it to be a reference to that. They say the phrase without pauses, or extra emphasis on the words "worst" and "ever". Had Strong Sad said, "WORST....commentary....EVER", without saying, "this is the" first, I'd agree. Unless it's said like that, it's most likely just a simple use of a common phrase, and not a reference. --[[User:AnarchyBalsac|AnarchyBalsac]]
===Football helmet = reference?===
The shot of the ATM with a football helmet chasing Strong Sad may be a reference to [[Wikipedia:Commander Keen|Commander Keen]], Defender of the Universe, who wore a helmet with a similar design (mostly yellow with at least one stripe down the middle) when saving the day!

*'''Decline''' The ATM and Keen have nothing else in common that suggests this might be a reference... besides, Keen's helmet has a green and white stripe, not a blue one. --[[User:phlip|phlip]] 01:21, 1 May 2005 (UTC)
**'''Second''' [[user:Donny vs Universe|Donny vs Universe]]
**'''Second''' Yeah, I thought that at first, but it's not really the same. [[User:Nosmorking|No Smorking]] 13:28, 1 May 2005 (UTC)
**'''Second, third, whatever''' Huh, I didn't notice that the stripe was not the right color. --[[User:NFITC1|NFITC1]] 23:31, 1 May 2005 (UTC)
**'''Second.''' Sometimes a football helmet is just ... awww, never mind! -- [[User:tomstiff|tomstiff]] 13:49, 2 May 2005 (UTC)
*'''Second.''' Dude, it's just a helmet. -Walking Armless
===The Clarke of infinity===
The "color of infinity" line in the chorus may be a reference to ''[[IMDB:tt0241317| The Colours of Infinity]]'', a 1995 television documentary by [[Wikipedia:Arthur C. Clarke|Arthur C. Clarke]] about [[Wikipedia:Fractal|fractal]] geometry. IMDb says: "This show relates the science of the M-Set to nature in a way that seems to identify the hand of God in the design of the universe itself."

*'''Decline''' Even if true, does this belong here? Given TBC didn't write the song and all... --[[User:phlip|phlip]] 01:21, 1 May 2005 (UTC)
**'''Second''' Try posting it here [http://www.tmbw.net/wiki/index.php/Interpretations:Experimental_Film] instead. [[User:AtionSong|AtionSong]] 5:37 May 2 2005
*'''Maybe, but still decline''' The line sounds more whimsical than reference-y to me. [[user:Donny vs Universe|Donny vs Universe]]
*'''Decline.''' Moonwatcher had no witty comment to add ... but he would think of something. --- [[User:tomstiff|tomstiff]] 13:48, 2 May 2005 (UTC)
*'''Decline''' Even if it was, this isn't the place to write it. TMBG didn't write the song just for h*r, it's their song. [[User:TakuaKaita600|TK600]] 00:09, 4 May 2005 (UTC)
===Now spell: bound===
The scene of Strong Sad shaving is possibly a reference to [[Wikipedia:Alfred Hitchcock|Alfred Hitchcock's]] ''[[IMDB:tt0038109| Spellbound]]''.
*'''And this fact should possibly be DECLINED!''' Possibly...puh. Proof. Wheres your proof? [[user:Donny vs Universe|Donny vs Universe]]
*'''Decline.''' Say it ain't so! I thought for sure it was a Gillette Mach 3 referrence! -- [[User:tomstiff|tomstiff]] 08:41, 2 May 2005
*'''Standing too close to you in DECLINE''' Just cuz he shaves does not mean he references a singled-out movie involving a shaving person. Does your dad ever go "hey honey, look at me, look, I'm shaving, just like in that one movie!" --[user: Lappy 486] [[User:Lappy 486|Lappy 486]] 03:06, 7 May 2005 (UTC)
*'''DECLINE... ED! Yeah, decline-ed''' Thoguh it's a good movie, I don't think it's a reference to it. It may, however, be a reference to the other meaniong of spellbound, meaning havinbg been set under a spell. If you change it to that, it may be accepted. -- [[User:Ju Ju Master|Ju Ju Master]]
*<b>Decline</b> I shave too, but I'm not thinking of any alfred hitchcock movie when I do it. He' just shaving, that's all there is to it. --[[User:AnarchyBalsac|AnarchyBalsac]]
===Un Chien Debaser===
"Un Chien Andalou" is the inspiration for the song "Debaser" by the Pixies.  Frank Black, lead singer of [[Wikipedia:Pixies|the Pixies]], is close friends with They Might Be Giants, and has toured with them.

*'''Accept''' All the links in the chain seem to be true, and even if it's not why TBC used that particular reference it's still an interesting fact. --[[User:phlip|phlip]] 01:21, 1 May 2005 (UTC)
*'''Decline''' Even if it is true, it has no place on the EF page. Thats a Pixies fact not a Homestar Runner one. [[user:Donny vs Universe|Donny vs Universe]]
**'''Second.''' -- [[User:tomstiff|tomstiff]]
***'''Third.''' --[[User:TakuaKaita600|TK600]] 21:39, 11 May 2005 (UTC)
**'''Rebuttal''' This explains a reference elsewhere. Simply put it in an "outside references" subsection and let it go yous guys. -da borg
**'''Personal Comment''' Un Chien Andalou gave me nightmares, don't watch it. ---[[User:the spludge|the spludge]] 22:08, 11 May 2005 (UTC)
===Calvin and the Cotton Gin (Declined)===
In a Calvin and Hobbes strip, Calvin sometimes would use "The Cotton Gin" as an answer to problems he did not know, even on math tests.
*'''Weak Decline''' Since the answer was right on that test (and never right on Calvin's tests) I don't think this is the case. --[[User:NFITC1|NFITC1]]
**'''Comment''' We never actually see the questions to the test (except the first, which is "Are you all going to be in my experimental film?"), so we don't know if the answer is right. [[User:Homestar Coder|Aurora Szalinski]] 09:47, 25 Mar 2005 (MST)
*** '''Comment on comment''' Actually, we know the answer was wrong, because the test-taker got an A+ after selecting a ''different'' answer (specifically, "Yeah!") --[[User:Jay|Jay]] 09:56, 26 Mar 2005 (MST)
*** '''Comment on my own comment''' Well, okay, actually, I was assuming that it was multiple-choice and that the test-taker was selecting the first of four possible answers (notice the hilight). I suppose four questions being on a different page never really occurred to me before now. Oh, well, whatever. The test-taker got an A+. --[[User:Jay|Jay]] 10:01, 26 Mar 2005 (MST)
**** '''Will the commentary never cease?''' You are right! I personally don't think it has much to do with whether it's a reference or not, though. [[User:Homestar Coder|Aurora Szalinski]] 10:57, 26 Mar 2005 (MST)
*****'''Hehe, cease. Tis a funny word.''' *watches as people give me wierd looks*... Well, its true. Cease is a funny word. Neway, I '''Decline'''.--[[User:-erson|-erson]] 10:57, 30 Mar 2005 (MST)
*'''Decline.''' Seems a bit of a stretch. --[[User:Trogga|Trogga]] 15:45, 24 Mar 2005 (MST)
*'''Weak Accept.''' This reference seems fine to me. Calvin did this a lot and I think of it when seeing "cotton gin" on a test. It might be a bit stretchy though. [[User:Homestar Coder|Aurora Szalinski]] 15:49, 24 Mar 2005 (MST)
*'''Second'''
*'''Decline.''' Theres an essay by Mike Nelson (of '''Mystery Science Theater 3000''' fame) about how Eli Whitney and the cotten gin were all kids used to learn about in school. So the cotten gin answer isn't really an original idea (or at least not one to put a specific reference on). [[User:Donny vs Universe|Donny vs Universe]]
*'''Weak Decline''' I read and own many Calvin and Hobbes comic collections. In my reading, I noticed that while Calvin did use The Cotton Gin as answers, he mostly just puts down random answers to questions he didn't know the correct answer to. Other answers include "Trostsky, Lexington, 1824", and so on. --[[User:acekirby13|acekirby13]] 17:27, 26 Mar 2005 (MST)
*'''Decwine''' This is true, but not relevant. [[User:Rudeboy87|Rudeboy87]] 08:50, 31 Mar 2005 (MST)
*'''Decline''' Or it could be that the question was 'What did Eli Whitney invent?' [[User:The_Pardack|The_Pardack]]
*'''Accept''' Sigh, the only accept. I've never even read only Calvin and Hobbes before and I know about the Cotton Gin thing. I've seen it many, many places. [[User:mibluvr13|mibluvr13]] 19:39, 8 Apr 2005 (MDT)


{{stuffcloseddecline}}
=== The Water ===
{{stufffact|The image of Strong Sad and the ATM knee-deep in water may be a reference to a scene in the film "Donnie Darko," where a [http://img300.echo.cx/img300/1626/floodedschoolintheexperimental.png similar image] can be seen, and it may also be the experimental film Strong Sad mentions in his commentary.}}
{{stuffverdict|01:23, 11 Jun 2005 (UTC)|07:46, 25 Jun 2005 (UTC)|unanimously declined|12|0|Experimental Film}}

==Broken link?==
Could someone verify the .swf for the director's commentary? [[User:Sgleason|S Gleason]] 05:08, 8 Jun 2005 (UTC)
:The swf downloads, but appears to be empty. Also, the cleanup template is generally used to mark articles which need a drastic revision / overhaul, not just one fix. <small><tt>[[User:Homestar Coder|<span style="color:#8B0000;">Aurora the Homestar Coder</span>]]</tt></small> 05:49, 8 Jun 2005 (UTC)
:It's good, but it does ''seem'' to be empty. I added clarification to the page - better now? {{User:phlip/sig}} 06:04, 8 Jun 2005 (UTC)
::Got it. <small><tt>[[User:Homestar Coder|<span style="color:#8B0000;">Aurora the Homestar Coder</span>]]</tt></small> 06:14, 8 Jun 2005 (UTC)
:::Thank you! And thanks for the feedback re the template. [[User:Sgleason|S Gleason]]