Homestar Runner Wiki Forum :: View topic - Conception. When is it the right time?

So, being the voice of god, are you subject to fallability?

Still does not change whether he really exists or not. That's the point you're not getting. God's existence is not contingent on your acknowledging him. Nor does it change whether or not he has the right to expect you to believe him and listen to what he has to say on any given subject.

To give you an example, if I decided that I didn't believe in speed limits, and just drove however fast I wanted, do you think that telling the policeman who pulled me over this would change whether or not he had the right to give me a ticket?

one can wax philosophical or religious about it all day long but people across the world participate and abstain from marriage as they see fit because that is their culture.

Your God can blow it out his backside for all I care because *GASP* I'm not a Christian.

Others have been to me, so I figured such blatancy would work. Plus, after hearing it over and over and over again for over 16 years (since I was about 6), it gets really old.

Pardon me, it's hard to be polite sometimes

Especially with a coercive "get married or you're going to Hell" speech.

(See, this is what I Feel like you're doing every time you try to proclaim your faith is greater than mine because you go to some building on Sundays. Doesn't feel so good, does it?)

But, it would behoove you to respect your elders and to think without restraint at this point.

Just because people in the past slaughtered in the name of God does not mean that you have dominion to tell me what to do, as much as you would vicariously in your mind wish me ill for making such statements and knocking you off of your holy pedistal.

As I said before, it was crude, but I refuse to be treated as a lesser because I don't follow a certain philosophy.

In my opinion, age doesn't make anyone better. The only thing an older person has that a younger person doesn't is knowlege.

Nobody here is/will treat you as a lesser because you aren't christian.

I believe that a couple should try to wait till their lives are in proper order to provide for a child, before they have one. Having been born into a world with parents that never realized their dreams, it gets quite depressing to analyze their broken lives. But I realize that at some point, a contempt attitude towards life emerges, and a willingness to keep on living still arises. A child will wish to have, but may not receive if they are born into such a world.

Author:	Didymus [ Thu Jun 22, 2006 8:58 pm ]
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And for now, that might be the wise choice. If I was their pastor, its exactly the kind of question I would be required to ask, though. But regardless of their situation, do you think that this makes marriage any less valid as an institution? Do you think that God really has nothing to say about the relationships between men and women and how they ought to be conducted, the very same God who created them to be man and woman?

Author:	DeathlyPallor [ Thu Jun 22, 2006 10:45 pm ]
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Who cares what God says? Not everyone's a Christian. It won't matter to those that arent. But, if you dealing with Christians when answering this question, they will vest more confidence into it.

Author:	Didymus [ Thu Jun 22, 2006 10:52 pm ]
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On one hand, you have a point: people who are not Christian will probably care very little about what God says. But on the other hand, if God does indeed have something to say on the subject, then it wouldn't do to simply ignore him, no more than it would be to ignore the policeman with the radar gun behind that billboard. So to answer your question, if people don't care what God has to say, they should.

Author:	DeathlyPallor [ Thu Jun 22, 2006 10:56 pm ]
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But to someone who doesn't believe in God, there is no "cop behind the billboard." Nor will they care if someone says so. If someone is solid in their belief, you'd best respect it. Your response is between you and your god. And whatever you have to discuss, you take care of. Just because you feel god has something to say on the subject... wait a second... who made you voice of god?

Author:	Didymus [ Thu Jun 22, 2006 11:01 pm ]
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But not believing in God doesn't change whether he exists or not. Who made me the voice of God? God. Through the call and by the authority he has given me as a minister of His Word and Sacraments.

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Author:	DeathlyPallor [ Thu Jun 22, 2006 11:05 pm ]
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It is said that what we believe in is made manifest on that particular level. I don't believe in the Judeo-Christian god, so thusly, he does not exist in my eyes. Trust me, what you just said has been the main excuse why people go on missions. So, being the voice of god, are you subject to fallability?

Author:	Didymus [ Thu Jun 22, 2006 11:14 pm ]
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Still does not change whether he really exists or not. That's the point you're not getting. God's existence is not contingent on your acknowledging him. Nor does it change whether or not he has the right to expect you to believe him and listen to what he has to say on any given subject. To give you an example, if I decided that I didn't believe in speed limits, and just drove however fast I wanted, do you think that telling the policeman who pulled me over this would change whether or not he had the right to give me a ticket? Quote: So, being the voice of god, are you subject to fallability? There has only been one infallable human being ever to walk the face of this planet, and I am not he. However, this does not change that he has chosen me to carry out his work here. I am fully aware of the mistakes I make, as I am also fully aware of my limitations. But I am also fully aware of the gifts I have been given to carry out my work. Doctors are also fallable, but they are trained professionals. Very few people are competent to argue medicine with a doctor. I, too, am a trained professional, with an M-Div to establish my credentials, as well as a call from Faith Lutheran Church and Good Shepherd Lutheran Church to carry out my duties as a minister of Word and Sacrament to these congregations. So while I may be fallable, I also have professional training and accountability to guide me in carrying out my ministry.

Author:	putitinyourshoe [ Fri Jun 23, 2006 9:19 pm ]
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thanks to pallor and acekirby for making my precise point about marriage in my absence. i can't seem to have enough time to post as much as i did earlier. ahh well. my exact point about marriage is what pallor and acekirby said: it is an enculturated idea in us and that is okay, but it is a good idea to realize that American values are not everyone's values. for example: we would never dream of marriage to a sister. well certain cultures' males could never marry a cousin that is mother's brother's daughter while mother's sister's daughter might be okay. some brothers share a wife in certain cultures. these make me (and most americans) uncomfortable because our culture doesn't accept that for whatever reason. one can wax philosophical or religious about it all day long but people across the world participate and abstain from marriage as they see fit because that is their culture.

Author:	DeathlyPallor [ Fri Jun 23, 2006 11:04 pm ]
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Just doing my part! putitinyourshoe wrote: one can wax philosophical or religious about it all day long but people across the world participate and abstain from marriage as they see fit because that is their culture. And you can't force people to do so either. Especially with a coercive "get married or you're going to Hell" speech. Because, people won't care. Especially when it is not part of their culture, religion or mode of philosophical or general thinking. ------- Just because the bible says something, it doesn't make it right. And I don't care how much any one says "God says this" or "God says that," I don't care. Your God can blow it out his backside for all I care because GASP I'm not a Christian. (See, this is what I Feel like you're doing every time you try to proclaim your faith is greater than mine because you go to some building on Sundays. Doesn't feel so good, does it?)

Author:	PieMax [ Fri Jun 23, 2006 11:11 pm ]
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DeathlyPallor wrote: Your God can blow it out his backside for all I care because GASP I'm not a Christian. You don't have to be so rude about it.

Author:	PieMax [ Fri Jun 23, 2006 11:22 pm ]
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DeathlyPallor wrote: Others have been to me, so I figured such blatancy would work. Plus, after hearing it over and over and over again for over 16 years (since I was about 6), it gets really old. Two wrongs don't make a right. It really pisses me off when people can't be mature about things and act like they're 13 when they're not.

Author:	PieMax [ Fri Jun 23, 2006 11:50 pm ]
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DeathlyPallor wrote: Pardon me, it's hard to be polite sometimes Boo friken hoo. Grow up and deal with it.

Author:	Didymus [ Sat Jun 24, 2006 12:13 am ]
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Actually, DP, PieMax has done nothing but confront your rude behavior. She has not tried to tell you what to believe, she has not condemned you for what you believe. She simply pointed out that your statement was offensive. And frankly it is. Funny how you keep harping on how you're sick and tired of everyone bashing you for not being a Christian, and yet you keep coming on here and telling us we're wrong for speaking our minds. You are a hypocrit, DP. You tell us we should respect the beliefs of others, and yet you condemn us for ours. You say you have the right to Tell What U Think, but you condemn us when we Tell What We Think, and accuse us bashing you over the head with hammers. Here's a clue for you, DP: if you want the right to TWUT, then you have to respect the rights of others to TWTT. Quote: Especially with a coercive "get married or you're going to Hell" speech. Funny, I don't remember saying anything of the sort. Heck, I don't even remember mentioning the word hell in this thread. Do you even have a freaking clue what you're tallking about? I never told anyone they would go to hell for not being married - be kind of ridiculous of me to do so, since I myself am not married. All I did was point out that marriage was God's plan. I never threatened anyone or even mentioned the word hell in this thread, and I challenge you to find where I did. Quote: (See, this is what I Feel like you're doing every time you try to proclaim your faith is greater than mine because you go to some building on Sundays. Doesn't feel so good, does it?) Aside from the obvious hypocracy of acting exactly like you've accused us of acting, I must also point out that you haven't exactly given me any reason to even consider your faith anything. Quote: But, it would behoove you to respect your elders and to think without restraint at this point. You're not exactly an elder here, DP. From your post, I'd think you must be like 60 or 70. But you're only freaking 22, and that's not exactly "elder" in my book. And if you're going to criticize Pie for not showing respect for her "elders" (and I don't think you're that much older than her), then what about showing respect for a 37-year-old professional clergyman? Last time I checked, 37 > 22 by a few years. More hypocracy from you: if you are going to demand respect from anyone, you need to show it. Quote: Just because people in the past slaughtered in the name of God does not mean that you have dominion to tell me what to do, as much as you would vicariously in your mind wish me ill for making such statements and knocking you off of your holy pedistal. First of all, all that "slaughtered in the name of God" is completely irrelevant to the current discussion, and I see it mainly as an attempt by you to sensationalize the "persecution" you claim people have been heaping on you. But here's your problem: Pie did nothing more than state that your behavior was rude (which it was). I challenge you to go through her three or four lines of post here and show where she threatened or even wished you harm. If you can't find anything, then your statement here is entirely false and you have no grounds to stand on in your criticism of her. Again, this is hypocracy on your part.

Author:	Alexander [ Sat Jun 24, 2006 12:35 am ]
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In my opinion, age doesn't make anyone better. The only thing an older person has that a younger person doesn't is knowlege. "I'm afraid I know too many things." I believe in conception after marriage, always. I'm might give some details later, but currently I can't write them.

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Author:	DeathlyPallor [ Sat Jun 24, 2006 12:38 am ]
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I don't know if you actually noticed this in the context of which I spoke, but I was also referencing situations outside of this fourm. I don't think this forum has existed for 16 years, now has it? Also, what I was referencing was example of how you kept on saying that marriage is necessary for the same reason over and over again, whilst ignoring the fact that not everyone in the world believes the same way you do. I know they don't believe the same way I do, I'm content with that. It just harkens back to the endless argument over proselytizing that happened and never ended because of a fundamental disagreement in philosophies. Ok, I admit, it was wrong to lump you with the rest of them, but your arguement sounded painfully like theirs. All I did was try to present a side to it that wasn't Christian, and I hate to say it, there is not rebuttal in the Bible that actually doesn't go after that idea without trying to zealously change their faith. By all cultural and social standards, such methods are painfully rude, and by the idea and experiences I've had on the board earlier (leading to my hiatus), it sounded as rude as what I had said. Take it how you will, but I meant it as a reflection of what I had experienced here. I admit it was crude, but some of the actions some of the other board members have taken with me, I saw no other option. I wanted to say something that would be on their level, a reflection as I said. As I said before, it was crude, but I refuse to be treated as a lesser because I don't follow a certain philosophy.

Author:	StrongRad [ Sat Jun 24, 2006 1:49 am ]
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DeathlyPallor wrote: As I said before, it was crude, but I refuse to be treated as a lesser because I don't follow a certain philosophy. Nobody here is/will treat you as a lesser because you aren't christian. Seriously, there are several members here who are not christian and I hold them in the same regard as our christian members. Saying "I was just getting down on 'their' level" is the equivalent to saying "they started it!". Pallor, you're better than that, man. Seriously.

Author:	Einoo T. Spork [ Sat Jun 24, 2006 2:01 am ]
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Alexander wrote: In my opinion, age doesn't make anyone better. The only thing an older person has that a younger person doesn't is knowlege. And better spelling. No seriously, that's what happens. USUALLY, the more knowledge and experience make you wiser/smarter/whatever. Of course, sometimes people are just stupid. But usally they get the wisdom and the knowledge and the such-and-such....... That make any sense? Or am I just rambling, as usual?

Author:	DeathlyPallor [ Sat Jun 24, 2006 3:22 am ]
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Quote: Nobody here is/will treat you as a lesser because you aren't christian. It just opened old wounds. Anyways, I did say it was dumb to lump them together with all of the others. Uncouth on my part.

Author:	Steve [ Sat Jun 24, 2006 3:36 am ]
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I believe that a couple should try to wait till their lives are in proper order to provide for a child, before they have one. Having been born into a world with parents that never realized their dreams, it gets quite depressing to analyze their broken lives. But I realize that at some point, a contempt attitude towards life emerges, and a willingness to keep on living still arises. A child will wish to have, but may not receive if they are born into such a world.

Author:	DeathlyPallor [ Sat Jun 24, 2006 3:40 am ]
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Steve wrote: I believe that a couple should try to wait till their lives are in proper order to provide for a child, before they have one. Having been born into a world with parents that never realized their dreams, it gets quite depressing to analyze their broken lives. But I realize that at some point, a contempt attitude towards life emerges, and a willingness to keep on living still arises. A child will wish to have, but may not receive if they are born into such a world. Very much a voice of reason on the subject here. I believe that that should be achieved as well... not only for the sake of the parents, but for the mental health of the child.