Philosophy

Metal Head · **Posted:** Sat May 06, 2006 1:47 am

Here I made a thread for all things concerning the meaning of life. Whats my opinion?

Without evil good can not exist. If there is no such thing as evil then good will become meaningless and will no longer be good but simply average. This comes to the theory: Good and evil are a never ending cycle of counter action. If good lasts too long evil will arrive and destroy it. Evil cannot exist too long because good will eventually destroy it. They are attracted to each other and neither can be destroyed. Sometimes there is a neutral zone.

<edit by StrongRad: The spelling bothered me.>

HHFOV · **Posted:** Sat May 06, 2006 5:02 pm

When one is thinking deeply, one cannot spell "philosophy" right in a thread title, as evidenced here...

Cleverdan · **Posted:** Sat May 06, 2006 5:13 pm

42. ...
Sorry, it had to be done.

PianoManGidley · **Posted:** Sat May 06, 2006 5:46 pm

Cleverdan wrote:

42. ...
Sorry, it had to be done.

Yeah, but 42 isn't the MEANING of life--it's the ultimate answer, to the ultimate question of life, the universe, everything. The answer is not necessarily the meaning.

Meaning of life, though? I'd just say to live. Enjoy life while you can...as long as you do it in a way that doesn't harm anyone else. Kinda generic, but, meh, it seems to work.

StrongRad · **Posted:** Sat May 06, 2006 7:03 pm

PianoManGidley wrote:

Cleverdan wrote:

42. ...
Sorry, it had to be done.

Yeah, but 42 isn't the MEANING of life--it's the ultimate answer, to the ultimate question of life, the universe, everything. The answer is not necessarily the meaning.

Meaning of life, though? I'd just say to live. Enjoy life while you can...as long as you do it in a way that doesn't harm anyone else. Kinda generic, but, meh, it seems to work.

The whole meaning of life is to figure out the meaning of life. Don't try too hard, though. When you figure it out, you die.

The Noid · **Posted:** Sat May 06, 2006 7:07 pm

...Isn't that a quote from a Bonus Stage episode?(The thing in the first post) i recall Stomach kIng and that one guy discussing that...

I agree on "Without evil there cannot be good." because without an alternative, how can we decide what's right and what's wrong? It's like without bad luck, there cannot be good luck.

StrongRad · **Posted:** Sat May 06, 2006 7:16 pm

The Noid wrote:

...Isn't that a quote from a Bonus Stage episode?(The thing in the first post) i recall Stomach kIng and that one guy discussing that...

I agree on "Without evil there cannot be good." because without an alternative, how can we decide what's right and what's wrong? It's like without bad luck, there cannot be good luck.

Kinda like "Beavis, if some stuff didn't suck, then cool stuff wouldn't be as cool", right?

The Noid · **Posted:** Sat May 06, 2006 7:19 pm

StrongRad wrote:

The Noid wrote:

...Isn't that a quote from a Bonus Stage episode?(The thing in the first post) i recall Stomach kIng and that one guy discussing that...

I agree on "Without evil there cannot be good." because without an alternative, how can we decide what's right and what's wrong? It's like without bad luck, there cannot be good luck.

Kinda like "Beavis, if some stuff didn't suck, then cool stuff wouldn't be as cool", right?

...a bit, I guess.

Didymus · **Posted:** Sat May 06, 2006 8:40 pm

Quote:

Without evil good can not exist. If there is no such thing as evil then good will become meaningless and will no longer be good but simply average.

Actually, this sounds like an R&P topic to me, and if I could move it, I probably would.

I disagree. Evil, in essence, is either the absence or the perversion of some preexisting good. That is where the interconnection between them is formed. Evil is a parasite, but cannot exist on its own.

Evil is to good what hunger is to food, darkness is to light, cold is to heat. From a certain perspective (specifically the one that we have as we journey through this broken, fallen world) dark and light appear to be a neverending cycle. In reality, though, once you move beyond the earth's boundaries, you are bathed in perpetual light. Night is nothing more than the shadow of the earth; beyond the earth, it is never night (unless you remain in its shadow, but that is only a tiny part of space compared to the rest of the light in our solar system).

The same is true with evil. As long as we exist within this earthly sphere, there will be cycles of pain and joy, darkness and light, cold and warmth. But once this earthly life is over, there remains an eternity of perfect goodness, a gift from the source of all goodness, God himself. God, who is perfectly good, is the source of all things, even those that became perverted and corrupt. But those things are temporary, while the goodness of God is everlasting.

But just as we can only know light if we come out from behind the earth's shadow into day, so we can only know God's perfect goodness if we can come out from the shadow of this earthly life and into God's eternal light.

Evil sucks its life from good, but without evil, good does not diminish, but find its ultimate fulfillment. But, I will agree with this: after enduring the darkness of the shadow of death, one can more appreciate the warmth of daylight.

IantheGecko · **Posted:** Sat May 06, 2006 8:52 pm

I believe that the purpose of life is to love. The Lord, your friends, and your enemies. Everyone.

Didymus · **Posted:** Sat May 06, 2006 8:57 pm

The purpose of life is to "Love the Lord God" and "Love your neighbor as yourself." And chocolate. MMMmmm, chocolate! *Homer Simpson drool noises*

IantheGecko · **Posted:** Sat May 06, 2006 9:07 pm

Too bad they didn't know about chocolate in the Bible. I think THAT was the real forbidden fruit.

Didymus · **Posted:** Sat May 06, 2006 9:16 pm

Why do you think the Spaniards wanted to conquer South America?

Metal Head · **Posted:** Sun May 07, 2006 2:08 am

Did I mention I wanted this to be a serious thread? No? Well stay on topic. The spanish invaded for gold. Not chocolate. The chocolate we now know today wasn't invented until 2 centuries later by the Swiss. Figures. I'm gonna stop contradicting myself now.

Didymus · **Posted:** Sun May 07, 2006 2:41 am

Oh, come on! Philosophy's the best thing in the world to laugh at! Don't believe that? Then read James Taylor's A Porcine History of Philosophy and Religion and Thomas Morris' The Bluffer's Guide to Philosophy. And let's not forget Monty Python's "The Philosophers' Drinking Song."

Metal Head · **Posted:** Sun May 07, 2006 12:11 pm

Fine. Just stay on topic and don't discuss why the Spanish attacked the americas.

Didymus · **Posted:** Sun May 07, 2006 7:13 pm

Alberto · **Posted:** Sun May 07, 2006 7:52 pm

Here's my idea on why we are here; If there is a god(or gods), He or she(or they) created man out of boredom. If there is no god(or gods), evolution and chance.

Lunar Jesty · **Posted:** Sun May 07, 2006 8:24 pm

The meaning of life is to be happy, and strive to make it so everyone else is as well. Isn't that all what we do? Everyone acts under their own happiness or the happiness of others. Maybe happiness isn't the right word: contentment, I think, is the correct word. People wouldn't listen to sad music if their main goal was to be happy, but they need it to soothe the soul for contentment. It's no big secret, either: every religion shows you how to reach contentment. No one would follow a religion that wouln't make themselves content.

Eldiran · **Posted:** Sun May 07, 2006 11:30 pm

Lunar Jesty wrote:

The meaning of life is to be happy, and strive to make it so everyone else is as well. Isn't that all what we do? Everyone acts under their own happiness or the happiness of others. Maybe happiness isn't the right word: contentment, I think, is the correct word. People wouldn't listen to sad music if their main goal was to be happy, but they need it to soothe the soul for contentment. It's no big secret, either: every religion shows you how to reach contentment. No one would follow a religion that wouln't make themselves content.

I have friends who think like that. But I find that to be incorrect. What will happiness or contentment do for you when you die? Emotions such as those are nothing worth living for. The same effect could be achieved by manipulating ourselves with drugs.

I don't pursue 'religion' for a feeling of well-being, but for the truth. In fact, if I were more ignorant than I am now, I'd have a helluva lot happier life.

But back onto the main topic:

Quote:

Actually, if you really think about it, evil itself is the incorrect or excessive pursuit of good. Nobody in this world (or out of it) ever pursues evil for evil's sake; they always want power, pleasure, etc., which are all good things in and of themselves. I'm pretty sure that even Satan is pursuing power, rather than just doing evil for evil's sake. This is where the whole fallen archangel thing really starts to make sense.

From my response to the same statement in another thread.

PianoManGidley · **Posted:** Mon May 08, 2006 12:11 am

Eldiran wrote:

Lunar Jesty wrote:

The meaning of life is to be happy, and strive to make it so everyone else is as well. Isn't that all what we do? Everyone acts under their own happiness or the happiness of others. Maybe happiness isn't the right word: contentment, I think, is the correct word. People wouldn't listen to sad music if their main goal was to be happy, but they need it to soothe the soul for contentment. It's no big secret, either: every religion shows you how to reach contentment. No one would follow a religion that wouln't make themselves content.

I have friends who think like that. But I find that to be incorrect. What will happiness or contentment do for you when you die? Emotions such as those are nothing worth living for. The same effect could be achieved by manipulating ourselves with drugs.

I'm not sure if he necessarily means it to be a conscious pursuance of happiness and contentment--I believe it's much more instinctive and natural. I mean, if you think about it, every decision we make in our lives is based upon our inner desire to appease ourselves the best way we know how given our circumstances.

Metal Head · **Posted:** Mon May 08, 2006 12:17 am

My opinion is this. You can achieve great things, then you die and they don't matter. Unless you believe in an afterlife where you will be punished for being a bad person then there is nothing compelling you to achieve anything. People like that should live under communism. No matter what you achieve you get the same pay.

IantheGecko · **Posted:** Mon May 08, 2006 12:24 am

What does communism have to do with not believing in an afterlife?

Eldiran · **Posted:** Mon May 08, 2006 12:36 am

PianoManGidley wrote:

I'm not sure if he necessarily means it to be a conscious pursuance of happiness and contentment--I believe it's much more instinctive and natural. I mean, if you think about it, every decision we make in our lives is based upon our inner desire to appease ourselves the best way we know how given our circumstances.

Whether it's conscious or subconscious, it's still a state of mind, which can be easily manipulated, even if we haven't the drugs to do it.

I'm inclined to disagree with you about our inner desires. Humans tend to confuse moral impulses and happiness. While acting morally does bring a feeling of well-being, we don't act that way for the sake of the feeling. Otherwise our actions become selfish and therefore not very moral. Which indicates that there is a deeper truth hidden in our moral impulses, since happiness is clearly not their purpose.

It seems that those who 'pursue happiness' tend to try to find a balance between following moral impulses and human impulses.

Metal Head wrote:

My opinion is this. You can achieve great things, then you die and they don't matter. Unless you believe in an afterlife where you will be punished for being a bad person then there is nothing compelling you to achieve anything. People like that should live under communism. No matter what you achieve you get the same pay.

You actions do matter, because they affect other people and their souls. And something will happen to your soul regardless of what you believe. ...and I don't get your communism comment either. People like who?

Metal Head · **Posted:** Mon May 08, 2006 12:44 am

In communism you achieve nothing cus the economy is planned. No matter what you do you get the same pay as everyone. This is why people there don't try. And communism believes in atheism. Hence the lack of a need to try to achieve something. I try to achieve something for spiritual reasons.

Eldiran · **Posted:** Mon May 08, 2006 12:47 am

But you said that you think your acheivements don't matter. Does that mean you think you should be a communist?

putitinyourshoe · **Posted:** Mon May 08, 2006 2:50 am

communism requires an atheist society because the point isn't personal achievement or comfort through myths (this isn't what i believe just a quick rationalization of communism). the point is rather the idea that the greatest achievement is the equal treatment of everybody and full employment with everybody performing up to their capacity. communism the philosophy and the practice differ widely mostly because there is always division between the ideal and the real.

i dont think communism is a system for slackers, nor is it some evil freedom-hating america destroying idea. rather it emphasizes a different system of achievement than personal gains, something very alien to those of us in the West.
i don't think i could do it, even if the ideal communism was the reality. it would be hard to give up everything i know this far in life.
plus on a techinical note, communism doesn't give everyone the same paycheck. people work to their maximum ability and income is redistributed at intervals (usually after a year or whatever) but again in practice this is different.

PianoManGidley · **Posted:** Mon May 08, 2006 5:06 am

Metal Head wrote:

My opinion is this. You can achieve great things, then you die and they don't matter. Unless you believe in an afterlife where you will be punished for being a bad person then there is nothing compelling you to achieve anything. People like that should live under communism. No matter what you achieve you get the same pay.

I'm gonna have to agree with Eldiran on this one. I mean, the fear of a negative consequence for not acting "good" is not (and should not be) the only influence a person has to do good and moral things. You act as if morality is inherently tied into religion, which it is not--there have been plenty of moral and upstanding people who were atheist or areligious.

Whenever someone achieves a great something, it matters--it echoes throughout time and affects the lives of surrounding people. That doesn't change just because of the person's religious beliefs.

Lunar Jesty · **Posted:** Tue May 09, 2006 1:36 am

Eldiran wrote:

Lunar Jesty wrote:

The meaning of life is to be happy, and strive to make it so everyone else is as well. Isn't that all what we do? Everyone acts under their own happiness or the happiness of others. Maybe happiness isn't the right word: contentment, I think, is the correct word. People wouldn't listen to sad music if their main goal was to be happy, but they need it to soothe the soul for contentment. It's no big secret, either: every religion shows you how to reach contentment. No one would follow a religion that wouln't make themselves content.

I have friends who think like that. But I find that to be incorrect. What will happiness or contentment do for you when you die? Emotions such as those are nothing worth living for. The same effect could be achieved by manipulating ourselves with drugs.

I don't pursue 'religion' for a feeling of well-being, but for the truth. In fact, if I were more ignorant than I am now, I'd have a helluva lot happier life.

Sorry I took so long to get back to you here. I have a rather cynical view of things: people don't care what happens to them after they die. People like to feel as if they've made a difference, that's why teachers, social workers, etc. exist. You say it's not for the feeling, and I agree. It's for the suprise and contentment of placing a bit of you in someone else. Human beings are strange things: for some reason, they always want themselfves to stay around for a long time. From the first primitive man who hammered a rough carcature of himself on a rock wall, that's what he wanted to do. Maybe that's the meaning of life: to achive superficial immortality.

As for religion: I've been cynical here too. I've always believed the reasons people look for religion is to find something to welcome them in. Their being will welcome them in, but so will the community around you. I never really understood the quest for truth: what use is truth? Will you feel content once you recieve the truth? Or is it more of knowing how to fufil your destiny in life? Learn how to achive your superficial immortality? My philosophy here is something I'd like to change: I can't do anything except be an agnostic if I keep thinking like this.

PianoManGidley · **Posted:** Tue May 09, 2006 3:11 am

Lunar Jesty wrote:

I never really understood the quest for truth: what use is truth? Will you feel content once you recieve the truth? Or is it more of knowing how to fufil your destiny in life? Learn how to achive your superficial immortality? My philosophy here is something I'd like to change: I can't do anything except be an agnostic if I keep thinking like this.

Truth improves our lives. We have technological advancements that improve our quality of life because science has developed that far. Science and mathematics is based on discovering physical truths. So I guess we try to apply the same concept to the social and the metaphysical, trying to find universal "truths" so that it may improve our quality of life. Problems arise, though, by applying our own subjective nature and individual experiences, meaning that we will always have a tainted view of the world no matter how hard we try to be objective.

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