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muhammad dipiction controversy.
http://forum.hrwiki.org/viewtopic.php?f=13&t=6947		 Page 1 of 3
Author:  Alberto [ Sun Feb 05, 2006 1:38 am ]
Post subject:  muhammad dipiction controversy.
Whoa!
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jyllands-Posten_Muhammad_cartoons_controversy
I do see why They would be mad,
some extreamist Muslims have writen death threats to the cartoonists,
which makes Me mad that this will add to how most people think of Muslims: barbaric terrorists(Which is not true).
discuss.
Author:  Jello B. [ Sun Feb 05, 2006 1:57 am ]
Post subject: 
Ugh. We don't need any more hate towards arabic people. A few weeks ago my grandfather's wife said "Don't tell me Islam is a peaceful religion because it isn't." She's very Christian and right wing, but man, that's just nuts. I didn't say anything, and neither did my dad, but we strongly disagreed.
Author:  Alberto [ Sun Feb 05, 2006 2:05 am ]
Post subject: 
Jello B. wrote:
Ugh. We don't need any more hate towards arabic people. A few weeks ago my grandfather's wife said "Don't tell me Islam is a peaceful religion because it isn't." She's very Christian and right wing, but man, that's just nuts. I didn't say anything, and neither did my dad, but we strongly disagreed.

I know, its just so repulsive, one cartoon dipiction shows muhammad with a bomb in His turban, I cant think of anything that would be more offensive to the islamic religion.
Author:  StrongRad [ Sun Feb 05, 2006 2:27 am ]
Post subject: 
Oh. Erm.. Gee..

Yeah, I can see why they're mad. I would be too.

I think the violence is going a bit far, as it's "proving" the cartoon correct.

Like Alberto, I think it's sad that, if anything, this will add to the negative stereotype of Islam. Of course, that's probably what the cartoonists were trying to do.
Author:  Cobalt [ Sun Feb 05, 2006 2:37 am ]
Post subject: 
the reaction to the cartoon proves that its depiction of Muslims (not all, obviously, but *enough* of them, in Arab countries) was perfectly apt. unfortunately. it's a good argument for democratizing the area. i mean, if a cartoon gets this kind of reaction...
Author:  StrongRad [ Sun Feb 05, 2006 2:56 am ]
Post subject: 
Cobalt wrote:
the reaction to the cartoon proves that its depiction of Muslims (not all, obviously, but *enough* of them, in Arab countries) was perfectly apt. unfortunately. it's a good argument for democratizing the area. i mean, if a cartoon gets this kind of reaction...


I disagree..

I think that, while a majority of Muslims are offended by this (as well they should be), it's a minority that are acting like the 'tards.

It's sad, too, because they will get all of the coverage.
In that sense, Christians and Muslims are all alike. People ignore the good done by their respective organizations and only focus on the bad, just because they seek to put both religions down.
Author:  Mr.KISS [ Sun Feb 05, 2006 3:07 am ]
Post subject: 
I think the reaction is a bit much. It's just a cartoon. But, I do see why they could be angry.
Author:  Prof. Tor Coolguy [ Sun Feb 05, 2006 3:16 am ]
Post subject: 
Jello B. wrote:
Ugh. We don't need any more hate towards arabic people. A few weeks ago my grandfather's wife said "Don't tell me Islam is a peaceful religion because it isn't." She's very Christian and right wing, but man, that's just nuts. I didn't say anything, and neither did my dad, but we strongly disagreed.


And that's the basic flaw, one religion says the other doesn't really exsist and the other religion says the same thing about the first one. This goes on and on 'till shots are fired, then it gets deadly.

And if Denmark thinks it's safe from any sort of terrorist attack then they've got to be damn fools, they're even closer to the Middle East than the US is.
Author:  Rogue Leader [ Sun Feb 05, 2006 5:49 pm ]
Post subject: 
I can understand why they are angry. But the violence is a bit much. I mean, a boycott is grood, but torching an embassy (sp?) is an overstep.
Author:  Kittie Rose [ Sun Feb 05, 2006 10:14 pm ]
Post subject: 
I really think these Islam people in particular are nothing more than bullies. It's not as if they give a crap about respect and tolerance back in their countries, sentencing homosexual children to death.

Still, this is exactly why you shouldn't try to mess with it - countries like Iran are setting themselves more and more away from the rest of the world, and are doing themselves much more damage in the long run, but with much less in the way of loss of life.
Author:  Douglas [ Sun Feb 05, 2006 10:54 pm ]
Post subject: 
Hm.

All I have to say is, I didn't see any outcry with that movie depicting Jesus as a homosexual.
Author:  IantheGecko [ Sun Feb 05, 2006 11:18 pm ]
Post subject: 
I thought that was an urban legend!
Author:  Douglas [ Sun Feb 05, 2006 11:36 pm ]
Post subject: 
Oh, dang. I thought that was real. I was almost positive that it was coming out soon... Shows how smart I am. :blush:
Author:  Alberto [ Sun Feb 05, 2006 11:39 pm ]
Post subject: 
Kittie Rose wrote:
I really think these Islam people in particular are nothing more than bullies. It's not as if they give a crap about respect and tolerance back in their countries, sentencing homosexual children to death.

Still, this is exactly why you shouldn't try to mess with it - countries like Iran are setting themselves more and more away from the rest of the world, and are doing themselves much more damage in the long run, but with much less in the way of loss of life.

Well Your not thinking of the non-extreamists are You?
Author:  StrongRad [ Mon Feb 06, 2006 12:19 am ]
Post subject: 
Douglas wrote:
Hm.

All I have to say is, I didn't see any outcry with that movie depicting Jesus as a homosexual.


Well, there IS a slight difference there. Those images depicted Mohammed as someone who went around killing people for no good reason.

Given the two choices, gay or terrorist, I would pick the gay Jesus any day.
(the only real problem I would have with a gay Jesus is that it would be portraying Him in a sexual light, and as far as I can tell, He was asexual.. of course, that's a topic for a whole other thread)

Of course, that's assuming that whole "gay Jesus" thing was real.

The Muslims have a real valid beef here. While I don't support the violence, I understand why they're so freakin' upset. That terrorist thing is a REALLY UNFAIR stereotype that a minority of people, (real jerk wads, to put it mildly) who say they follow Islam, have gotten them all labeled with.
Author:  lahimatoa [ Mon Feb 06, 2006 3:44 am ]
Post subject: 
While I agree that those Muslims who are threating to kill and kidnap over this cartoon are in the minority, I'd sure like to hear more outrage from majority Muslims condemning this reaction.

Because thus far, I haven't heard a word.

And where I come from, failing to speak out against those you associate with when they are in the wrong is the same as supporting them.
Author:  Jerome [ Mon Feb 06, 2006 6:01 am ]
Post subject: 
Well, imagine if your closest-held beliefs were insulted like that. Wouldn't you be outraged?

I agree, torching an embassy's going over the line. But there are madmen in every group.
Author:  lahimatoa [ Mon Feb 06, 2006 6:06 am ]
Post subject: 
Actually, my closest beliefs have been insulted like that.

And while I didn't appreciate it, I was far from outraged.

And far from condoning anyone who would suggest killing those responsible.

And far, far from being angry to the point of becoming murderous myself.
Author:  DukeNuke [ Mon Feb 06, 2006 5:44 pm ]
Post subject: 
I hope this gets calmed down soon, I'd rather not see it go any further...
Denmarks embassy was not the only embassy that burned, the Swedish, Norwegian and Chilean also got burned...

It would be horrible if our 200 years of peace would be broken, but I suppose that since we stayed out of the two world wars, we'll stay out of this, however it turns out.
Author:  Sarge [ Mon Feb 06, 2006 5:49 pm ]
Post subject: 
Frankly, these Muslims need to take a chill pill.
It was a freeking cartoon. Get over it.

I swear, if you're so offended by a cartoon that you feel the need to firebomb an embasy, you aren't doing your cause any favors. Anyone who's claiming that their religion is a religion of peace and who then goes out and commits violence in the name of that same religion will get no sympathy from me.

And you wonder why the Neocons all hate arabs so much. I hate the Neocons, don't get me wrong, by they have a point: These religious fundamentalist jackasses who call themselves Islamic are about as holy as a rotten sock. Their agenda involves the represion of their own people in the name of their god as a way to rally their people against a coveiniently uniting enemy: The West (Or, as the Iranaian branch of Nutjobs 'R Us likes to call it, "The Great Satan"). Becasue unveiled women are the work of the Devil, of course. :rolleyes:

If these idiots who are running around protesting in the streets over a set of political cartoons think that this will lead to the surpression of anti-islamic cartoons in the west... well, lets just say that they've got another thing coming. All this will do is re-enforce the immage they already have in western media as being a bunch of sheeple who are so entrenched in a religios mind-set that they can be brought to violence over supposedly peacefull religious principles: In other words, they're nothing but an unrully mob whio like to break things and set things on fire... oh, golly where have we seen THAT image before? Hmmm? Anyone been to the Musilm commmunities in France lately?

Anyways, I'm an atheist so you can't upset my either way with a cartoon. Car bomb? Yes. Cartoon? Not so much.
Author:  Sarge [ Mon Feb 06, 2006 5:54 pm ]
Post subject: 
DukeNuke wrote:
I hope this gets calmed down soon, I'd rather not see it go any further...
Denmarks embassy was not the only embassy that burned, the Swedish, Norwegian and Chilean also got burned...

It would be horrible if our 200 years of peace would be broken, but I suppose that since we stayed out of the two world wars, we'll stay out of this, however it turns out.

Um, 200 years of peace? There was this little thing called World War II a while back, middle of the last century, if I remember correctly. You might have seen the movie. Anyways, unless you're Swiss or perhaps Martian, your country was involved in that war. And I'm not so sure about the Martians.
Author:  StrongRad [ Mon Feb 06, 2006 5:57 pm ]
Post subject: 
No offense, Sarge, but since you're an atheist, you really don't understand how much something like this can offend a religious person. Of course, you ARE right about the firebombings hurting their cause much more than it's helping it.

I'm in the middle on this one. On one hand, the cartoon was highly offensive. On the other hand, I don't support the violence. On yet another hand (yeah, I'm a mutant, I know), I support freedom of speech, even when said speech offends.

I don't know where I stand on this.
Author:  Sarge [ Mon Feb 06, 2006 6:10 pm ]
Post subject: 
StrongRad wrote:
No offense, Sarge, but since you're an atheist, you really don't understand how much something like this can offend a religious person. Of course, you ARE right about the firebombings hurting their cause much more than it's helping it.

I'm in the middle on this one. On one hand, the cartoon was highly offensive. On the other hand, I don't support the violence. On yet another hand (yeah, I'm a mutant, I know), I support freedom of speech, even when said speech offends.

I don't know where I stand on this.

:eek:
Get him! He's a mutant!

Darn mutants with their extra arms. :mrgreen:
Well so long as you don't stand on me. That's the important thing.
Let it never be said that I didn't give a thre-amred mutant a chance. :eekdance:
Author:  Kittie Rose [ Mon Feb 06, 2006 7:01 pm ]
Post subject: 
StrongRad wrote:
No offense, Sarge, but since you're an atheist, you really don't understand how much something like this can offend a religious person. Of course, you ARE right about the firebombings hurting their cause much more than it's helping it.

I'm in the middle on this one. On one hand, the cartoon was highly offensive. On the other hand, I don't support the violence. On yet another hand (yeah, I'm a mutant, I know), I support freedom of speech, even when said speech offends.

I don't know where I stand on this.


This isn't even a religious issue. The cartoon was blatantly targetted at the muslims that support this kind of nonsense(which there are a few of unfortunately, due to all people being inherently stupid) and was pointing out the absurdity of any well-meaning religion being intertwined with terrorism.

OOI I was playing with my Wolverine figure as I typed this.
Author:  StrongRad [ Mon Feb 06, 2006 7:08 pm ]
Post subject: 
Kittie Rose wrote:
StrongRad wrote:
No offense, Sarge, but since you're an atheist, you really don't understand how much something like this can offend a religious person. Of course, you ARE right about the firebombings hurting their cause much more than it's helping it.

I'm in the middle on this one. On one hand, the cartoon was highly offensive. On the other hand, I don't support the violence. On yet another hand (yeah, I'm a mutant, I know), I support freedom of speech, even when said speech offends.

I don't know where I stand on this.


This isn't even a religious issue. The cartoon was blatantly targetted at the muslims that support this kind of nonsense(which there are a few of unfortunately, due to all people being inherently stupid) and was pointing out the absurdity of any well-meaning religion being intertwined with terrorism.

OOI I was playing with my Wolverine figure as I typed this.


It wasn't targeted at Islam, you're right, BUT when you mock a central figure of the religion, you have to expect that you're going to rouse everyone in that religion.

I mean, this is kinda like mocking Jesus to anger Fred Phelps. Of course, it'd work, but you'd also anger almost every other Christian on the planet.
Author:  Sarge [ Mon Feb 06, 2006 7:10 pm ]
Post subject: 
They're not stupid. They're just brainwashed.

By the way, what does "00I" mean?
Author:  lahimatoa [ Mon Feb 06, 2006 7:26 pm ]
Post subject: 
This is nice.

From Muslim youth

Good form, young people.
Author:  Kittie Rose [ Mon Feb 06, 2006 7:49 pm ]
Post subject: 
Quote:
It wasn't targeted at Islam, you're right, BUT when you mock a central figure of the religion, you have to expect that you're going to rouse everyone in that religion.


People have to take that kind of thing lightly. Do I care that much that Stargate "ruined" many great pagan patheons? Not really.
Author:  Sarge [ Mon Feb 06, 2006 9:28 pm ]
Post subject: 
Kittie Rose wrote:
Quote:
It wasn't targeted at Islam, you're right, BUT when you mock a central figure of the religion, you have to expect that you're going to rouse everyone in that religion.


People have to take that kind of thing lightly. Do I care that much that Stargate "ruined" many great pagan patheons? Not really.

It only "runined" them if you stongly belive in the Stargate universe. But since you don't care, natch you're not a devote of that subculture (if it can be called a subculture).

I don't have anything against religion, per se, but when it becomes Organised Religion then, to my mind, it's one notch on the sociohistorical scale away from a dictatorship. Someone tells you what is so, and if you have the audacity to say that the sky is blue when the powers-that-be insist that it, in fact, a sublime shade of pink... well, you're screwed. You're a blashphemer, and religions usualy have some sort of special kind of hell reserverd for blashphemers. Human beings being what they are, the god-frearing sheaples can't be content with their God dealing out punishment to the blashphemer in his divine time-frame; oh no. They feel justified in stying themselves as the "Hand of God" or some such nonsense and then proceding to dish out their own uniquiely branded brand of brandished brandiment (also availible in brandings). This is where the whole apple cart tips over, as far as I'm concerned. Such vanity and hyubris to asume the role of a servent of God: this implies that you somehow know God's will for someone other than yourself. Now, knowing your onw part in the grand, cosime, scheme of things is one thing: For the sake of argyument I'll grant that it might be so. But, I'm not willing to surrender my will to someone else's on the flimsy basis of what amount to "God said so". It's not that I doubt the piety of the messenger, just his sanity. There have been many examples of me and women who were both widely acknoledged to be religious authorities and also were widely regarded as happening to be nuttier than a fruitcake. I don't think I need to cite examples here, your cultural memory will fill in the blanks, I'm sure.

"It's not that I'm afraid to die, it's just that I don't want to be there when it happens" - Woody Allen.
Author:  DukeNuke [ Tue Feb 07, 2006 2:33 pm ]
Post subject: 
Sarge wrote:
Um, 200 years of peace? There was this little thing called World War II a while back, middle of the last century, if I remember correctly. You might have seen the movie. Anyways, unless you're Swiss or perhaps Martian, your country was involved in that war. And I'm not so sure about the Martians.

Close, I'm swedish. And, yeah, we stayed out of the world wars.

But anyway, the cartoon was published by some private newspaper, so the goverment had nothing to do with it. So it's a bit odd that they burn embassies. Here in the west the goverment does not controll the newspapers. However, it's a diffrent matter down there at the burninators. There the newspapers are controlled by the goverment, so anything that's written in the newspaper is approved by the goverment. And if the people there don't know any diffrent, they would likely think that the danish goverment was fully responsible for the cartoon.

...sigh... why is it so outrageously hard for people to just be nice to eachother in this world?
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