Homestar Runner Wiki Forum

What? I don't understand what you're trying to say.

How does an opinion stop being an opinion? Is it simply because you don't agree with it? Regardless of its merit, prejudice is still an opinion.



Careful with the language. The conservatives feel the same way the liberals felt when they controlled the power. It sounds to me like you are doing the same thing they are (Using your current circumstances as a stepping stool for your arguments)



Liberalism has its own set of draw backs when taken to the extremes, wouldn't you agree? As for the "horror stories you hear" only from conservative lips... You'll have to prove that, I'm afraid.



Correct me if I am wrong here StrongRad, but I think the original quote was a typo. I read the sentence "Prejudice is not a conservative trait any more than it is a liberal trait." (emphasis mine) And I would agree with that sentence. I don't know many "pure" political groups that aren't without their bad apples.



I agree with most of what you are saying here (don't think that I am out to get you But at times it seems that you let your dislike of conservatives cloud your judgement.


Note:: I live in Utah, and I consider myself to be liberal (just about anywhere outside of Utah would consider me to be conservative, I am sure of that).

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It's an invalid one.

Opinions are formed out of being informed about something in a specific manner and following some level of reason and questioning of that source.

There is simply no room to "disagree" with homosexuals. It doesn't make sense.

Especially in this day and age. Judgment of someone's sexual preference has never been valid. It's only been driven by the dogmatic principles of religions in societies.

In contrast to what is going on here in the USA, the ancient Greeks considered it normal, and they were one of the world's great civilizations.

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...or is there? *blink blink* {hides}

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Right. The Greeks were the ones who pointed out the debating logic I love so much too.

I can't see any valid case for having an opinion here, at least not in the manner that people do.

I have to laugh at people being against homosexuality for "Valid" reasons and not out of fear, which equates "scripture". Again, the cotton polyester mix argument applies.

That's not valid. You can have a person view on homosexuality and homosexuals in the same way you can have those on people who dye their hair red. You don't "disagree" with people dying their hair red. It's just a thing people do and it's highly insulting to make out that it's wrong any more than anything else two consenting adults do together.
Taking it any further than that is nonesensical.

Rosalie - Very true. I notice that when a someone who is against homosexuality tries to validate their point, they end up going to scripture. The arguement based on scripture does not matter to someone who is not a Christian.

Unfortunately, the far right in this country does not want to acknowledge that there are more than just Christians in the united states.

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A liberal in Utah is a moderate in New York.

Homosexuality is something that we are all going to have to get used to. This generation is by far the most tolerant, and we are going to grow increasingly tolerant as the generations come and go.

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I actually think the 90s as a whole was more tolerante; at least later on in the 90s. Now we're suffering the conservative kick-back.

Rosalie - You're absolutely right. But, the thing is, the conservative right made issues of things that shouldn't have been made issues of, and won a lot of votes over nothing but BS. They did nothing but make us broke, start a bs war over oil, and destroy years of social progress.

But with the shrub's approval ratings in the toilet, I think that people are finally getting what you and I have been saying this whole time.

Deck The Grave - It's almost 2006, I think that we should have already achieved tolerance already... but humanity in a way is pathetic...

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Invalid or not, it is still an opinion, right??

As for the source of opinions, I have to completely disagree with your reasoning. If you had included the words "well thought out" or "intelligent" or "rational" before opinions, then I would agree with you 100%. But for the most part people don't use common sense before making up their minds about something. Look at the state our country, no... the state our world is in; do you think that is because all of the reasoning and questioning that occured before people started making opinions?

In short, opinions don't have to be rational, sensical, well thought out, level headed, or valid for that matter... but that is what makes them what they are.... Opinions!



I agree completely. While homosexuality doesn't make sense to me, I can respect someone else's judgement to do whatever they want to with their body. (Of course I have my opinions about what will happen based on their choices, but that is true for anything, not just sexual preference.) Every action has a consequence, some good, some not so good. If you kill someone, you go to jail. If you help an old lady cross the road, you get kicked in the shin for being a goody-goody

I don't see why I can't have the opinion "I don't agree with homosexuality, but I still agree with homosexuals" (if that makes any sense)



I agree with the last part of your post. The opinions that a large percentage of people hold on homosexuality isn't valid. It is one based on bigotry, fear, hatred, ignorance, whatever you want to call it.



I am not trying to use scripture as my argument, but why can't it be one? If you truly believe in something (as some that quote scripture to fight their battles do), why can't you use it to support your causes. Before you get upset, realize that I am not justifying it as "righteous", I am just acknowledging it for what it is.

I don't know about this "cotton polyester mix" argument you are speaking of... I assume it is referrence to a previous post in this topic.



I don't exactly understand what you are getting at here. As far as I know, I can disagree with someone dying their hair red because it was a conscious choice on their part.

<hypothetically speaking>
If for whatever reason, I hate people who dye their hair red (perhaps because of my bovine nature), then that is my choice. I can hate people who choose to support someone (perhaps a facist dictator), or I can hate people who drive a certain type of car (stupid monster suv's), or I can choose to hate someone who chooses to follow a particular lifestyle (one which doesn't have the same sexual preference as me). That of course is implying that I believe homosexuality is a choice....
</hypothetically speaking>

Please understand that what I was just typing isn't what I believe. I don't know if homosexuality is a choice (concious or not). I have yet to see a "gay gene" or evidence of no such gene existing (agnostic?), so I can't rule that out or rule in favor of it. I do feel that people do choose to be gay in the society we live in. That is more of a decision based on the negative social stigma that occurs from "coming out". I.E. an individual may feel that he/she would get less hassle if they just pretended that they weren't gay and dated/married/whatever with members of the opposite sex, like "normal people", aka everyone else, was doing.

I suppose it's time to end this rant. To sum things up Rose, I agree with what you are posting. It doesn't make sense to hold negative opinions of people with a different sexual preference (or perhaps the same), but that doesn't mean people aren't going to do it.

To DeathlyPallor: Get back on topic... sheesh, I am sure you can find a bush-bash thread somewhere else. Take your liberal-hippie crap elsewhere But seriously, TOASTPAINT!

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Yeah, evolution is slow, homophobia and religious fanaticism are fast.

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Fair enough. It's an opinion, but it's fear and resentment butchered up into an opinion.

Exactly

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Stu - For one... I'm not a hippie, thank whatever's out there. Secondly, I'm just being honest. My opinions come from me being resonable and educated, not from an overdose of patchoulli. Besides, I didn't make references to Bush alone, but the whole right wing. So, when you say Bush bash, it shows your lack of attention to what I posted.

Deck the Grave - Well, yes. People are trying to justify homophobia via scripture. That arguement is laughable.

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I didn't make it clear enough. I was joking with you about the "liberal hippie" opinions. (I was trying to sound like the stereo-typical christian-conservative)

My toastpaint was simply referring to the fact that this is a discussion on homosexuality, not Iraq, oil, or "the shrub's approval ratings".

For the second time, ToastPaint!!!

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Coming into the homosexuality debate as one of those "evil, Bible thumping Republicans" you've heard so much about, I, too find it sad that people are using the Bible to justify homophobia.

Even for people who believe the Bible, and take it literally, the biblical argument seems weak in several ways. (granted, for those who don't believe the Bible, it's weaker in more)
1)People who condemn homosexuals on a "Bible says it's wrong" basis seem to be ignoring all of the things THEY are doing wrong.
2) I don't know that the Bible actually says anything about it being bad.
3) If it is wrong, God is not going to judge you for what someone else does. You stand, judged for your own sins, not theirs.

Notice on 2, how I said I don't know if being gay is a sin or whatever... It's based more in apathy than anything else. I don't really care if it's a sin or not. I'm not gay, so it doesn't matter to me one way or the other.

Either way, I don't think banning gay marriage, or anything related to homosexuality, in general is a good idea.
If it is a sin, then they'll pay for it, the same way all other sinners will pay for it, and God's punishment would make anything humans do seem miniscule. If it isn't a sin, then there's nothing to worry about.
Regardless of what people interpret the Bible to say, or what it actually means, everything will come out in the wash.

Is it possible for me to come off as bigoted AND open-minded in the same post, because I think I just did .

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If you can't fix it with a hammer, you have an electrical problem.

I agree with StrongRad. If it truly is a sin, God will judge, and no one else.

And people who use the bible as a justifacation to be mean, cruel, and hateful really annoy me. Like Fred Phelps... grrr.... IF you focus your energy on punishing the faults of others instead of your own, you're doing no one any good.

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Very true. If many of these supposed Xtians like Fred Phelps were to actually read the book they are pushing on people, they will realize that as people, they are in no right to judge anyone and that it is their god's job to do so. If they were really Christians, then they would actually pay attention to that.

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Yes, the Bible says homosexuality is a sin, and yes, the Bible says God, not man, will judge.

So let's not judge. Like you said.

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Homosexuality is completely unnatural. God did not intend people to act like this! It is not something that we should "just get used to", it is disgusting and just plain wrong.

Why is it disgusting? Just because it's two people of the same sex, it's disgusting? That's just nonsense. Why can't you people say it in a friendly way, if you don't like something? Jeez. I on the other hand have no problem with homosexuality whatsoever.

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Holland Pwns U

So are You saying that everybody should be against it?

If it were completely unnatural, then why is there evidence of homosexual animals?

Plus, God gave us free will...so I am going to take advantage of this fact and laugh at your ignorance and pity you.

Have you ever met, sat down with, and talked to a homosexual?

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That's what I'm wondering... Although I already know the answer.

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Holland Pwns U

Joker - I am sure I know as well... And saying he has no problem with homosexuality... and out and out saying that he does at the same time?

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When did he say he has no problem with homosexuality?

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Holland Pwns U

Nuts... I think I mixed it up... but still the guy is proving to be a hypo-christian. If anything, christianity should be less judgmental because they bore (by Rome and everywhere else) the same judgment that they are dishing out... Judging others for their differences is just history repeating itself.

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I will call you on all of those and raise you a Homosexual cousin.

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Closest I got is a about 10 homosexual friends... no relatives.

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